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Post by Hunter McCormick on Nov 5, 2019 15:13:10 GMT -6
The players: Jose Abreu, 1B, White Sox Madison Bumgarner, SP, Giants Gerrit Cole, SP, Astros Josh Donaldson, 3B, Braves Jake Odorizzi, SP, Twins Marcell Ozuna, OF, Cardinals Anthony Rendon, 3B, Nationals Will Smith, RP, Giants Stephen Strasburg, SP, Nationals Zack Wheeler, SP, Mets I think we can expect a no from Gerrit Cole.
EDIT:Accepted the offer: Jose Abreu, 1B, White Sox Jake Odorizzi, SP, Twins (I thought both were likely to accept.)
Declined the offer: Madison Bumgarner, SP, Giants Gerrit Cole, SP, Astros Josh Donaldson, 3B, Braves Marcell Ozuna *, OF, Cardinals Anthony Rendon, 3B, Nationals Will Smith *, RP, Giants Stephen Strasburg, SP, Nationals Zack Wheeler, SP, Mets (*I thought Ozuna and Smith were likely to accept.)Will Smith inked a three-year deal with the Braves for 13M/per plus a fourth year for at 13M with an optional buyout by the Braves for a mere $1M. Although the annual salary is far less than the QO, Smith locked up $40M on this deal.
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Post by ɮօʀȶǟʐ on Nov 5, 2019 15:27:25 GMT -6
Will Smith? Someone offered a reliever nearly $18m?
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Post by Hunter McCormick on Nov 5, 2019 15:52:09 GMT -6
Will Smith? Someone offered a reliever nearly $18m? Yeah, that's surprising. fwiw, Chapman would have had one thrown at him too if he hadn't extended with the Yankees for 2 years at nearly that much per.
I think Smith takes accepts the QO. Probably the guys whose last names begin with O, as well. Add Abreu to the yes column and I reckon the rest are all no.
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Post by ɮօʀȶǟʐ on Nov 5, 2019 17:32:00 GMT -6
Funny how no one used to take the QO until an Astro waste-of-space broke the cherry.
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Post by Hunter McCormick on Nov 5, 2019 17:56:23 GMT -6
I blame that on the Astros' front office. Throwing a QO at a dud, hoping he would reject it and the team would get a supplemental pick, blew up in their faces.
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Post by unionstation82 on Nov 5, 2019 17:59:13 GMT -6
Funny how no one used to take the QO until an Astro waste-of-space broke the cherry. Is it so much to ask Bregman to step it up more often in the postseason like Rasmus did in ‘15? |
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Post by unionstation82 on Nov 5, 2019 18:01:19 GMT -6
I blame that on the Astros' front office. Throwing a QO at a dud, hoping he would reject it and the team would get a supplemental pick, blew up in their faces. All of us were fooled when Rasmus became Bonds for a week. |
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Post by ɮօʀȶǟʐ on Nov 5, 2019 19:41:41 GMT -6
Back in those days, Rasmus was far from the only dud the Astros had.
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marshall
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Ephesians 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood...
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Post by marshall on Nov 6, 2019 9:40:24 GMT -6
I blame that on the Astros' front office. Throwing a QO at a dud, hoping he would reject it and the team would get a supplemental pick, blew up in their faces. Not winning isn't a loss. It was a no risk offer if we were willing to offer him a one year deal at that price. |
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Post by Saint on Nov 6, 2019 10:58:39 GMT -6
I don't expect any of them to accept if they're reasonable about what they're worth. They all could get multi-year contracts worth more total than $18 million. Smith is the only one I see possibly taking it.
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Post by Hunter McCormick on Nov 6, 2019 10:59:07 GMT -6
I blame that on the Astros' front office. Throwing a QO at a dud, hoping he would reject it and the team would get a supplemental pick, blew up in their faces. Not winning isn't a loss. It was a no risk offer if we were willing to offer him a one year deal at that price. Are we talking about the same guy? Dogface Rasmus? The risk was that he would sign. And he did. |
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marshall
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Ephesians 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood...
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Post by marshall on Nov 6, 2019 14:45:24 GMT -6
Not winning isn't a loss. It was a no risk offer if we were willing to offer him a one year deal at that price. Are we talking about the same guy? Dogface Rasmus? The risk was that he would sign. And he did. No. I was talking about Keuchel. We offered him a QO and no one would meet his price before it expired. We didn't get compensation, but we wouldn't have if we had not made a QO. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2019 14:48:57 GMT -6
Are we talking about the same guy? Dogface Rasmus? The risk was that he would sign. And he did. No. I was talking about Keuchel. We offered him a QO and no one would meet his price before it expired. We didn't get compensation, but we wouldn't have if we had not made a QO. After the mediocre half season Keuchel had, it worked out for the best. Except what round supplemental compensation pick would we have gotten? |
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Post by Hunter McCormick on Nov 6, 2019 15:01:02 GMT -6
Are we talking about the same guy? Dogface Rasmus? The risk was that he would sign. And he did. No. I was talking about Keuchel. We offered him a QO and no one would meet his price before it expired. We didn't get compensation, but we wouldn't have if we had not made a QO. Ah, that explains the disconnect. My post was in response to ɮօʀȶǟʐ, when he was referring to Dogface.
Who's on first?
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Post by Saint on Nov 6, 2019 15:57:32 GMT -6
No. I was talking about Keuchel. We offered him a QO and no one would meet his price before it expired. We didn't get compensation, but we wouldn't have if we had not made a QO. After the mediocre half season Keuchel had, it worked out for the best. Except what round supplemental compensation pick would we have gotten? His ERA+ was 121. I wouldn't call that mediocre. That would put him in the top-20 in the NL if he had pitched enough. (And been the 3rd best of any of our pitchers that threw over 65 innings.) It would have been nice to have that depth in the postseason. We'll be lucky if we can get that type of production from any starter not named Verlander or Greinke next year.  |
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Post by unionstation82 on Nov 6, 2019 16:12:51 GMT -6
After the mediocre half season Keuchel had, it worked out for the best. Except what round supplemental compensation pick would we have gotten? His ERA+ was 121. I wouldn't call that mediocre. That would put him in the top-20 in the NL if he had pitched enough. (And been the 3rd best of any of our pitchers that threw over 65 innings.) It would have been nice to have that depth in the postseason. We'll be lucky if we can get that type of production from any starter not named Verlander or Greinke next year. You should apply. Strom can turn you into Maddux. He is a god after all. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Nov 6, 2019 16:52:15 GMT -6
His ERA+ was 121. I wouldn't call that mediocre. That would put him in the top-20 in the NL if he had pitched enough. (And been the 3rd best of any of our pitchers that threw over 65 innings.) It would have been nice to have that depth in the postseason. We'll be lucky if we can get that type of production from any starter not named Verlander or Greinke next year. You should apply. Strom can turn you into Maddux. He is a god after all. lt is obvious that Strom is one of the top pitching coaches in the game.......He resurrected Charlie Morton's career.......helped Verlander..........and then helped turn Cole into what we saw this season. I would like to see them sign Michael Wacha and see what Strom can do with him. I also think keeping Aaron Sanchez is a good idea so we can see what Strom can do with him when he's healthy. Both are fairly cheap as starting pitchers go. |
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Post by Saint on Nov 6, 2019 17:00:57 GMT -6
His ERA+ was 121. I wouldn't call that mediocre. That would put him in the top-20 in the NL if he had pitched enough. (And been the 3rd best of any of our pitchers that threw over 65 innings.) It would have been nice to have that depth in the postseason. We'll be lucky if we can get that type of production from any starter not named Verlander or Greinke next year. You should apply. Strom can turn you into Maddux. He is a god after all. We'll see what type of magician Strom really is when he's trying to coax Urquidy, McCullers, Whitley, Lasagna through the season next year. (And don't forget the bullpen of Pressly, Osuna, Peacock, Cheeseburger, and Gatorade.) |
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Post by blcoach8 on Nov 6, 2019 17:05:26 GMT -6
You should apply. Strom can turn you into Maddux. He is a god after all. We'll see what type of magician Strom really is when he's trying to coax Urquidy, McCullers, Whitley, Lasagna through the season next year. (And don't forget the bullpen of Pressly, Osuna, Peacock, Cheeseburger, and Gatorade.) had you rather have an idiot like Doug Brocail??? I don' t know any pitching coaches I had rather have than Strom. |
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Post by ɮօʀȶǟʐ on Nov 6, 2019 18:45:08 GMT -6
His ERA+ was 121. I wouldn't call that mediocre. That would put him in the top-20 in the NL if he had pitched enough. (And been the 3rd best of any of our pitchers that threw over 65 innings.) It would have been nice to have that depth in the postseason. We'll be lucky if we can get that type of production from any starter not named Verlander or Greinke next year. You should apply. Strom can turn you into Maddux. He is a god after all. The better job for him would be to replace the Archcriminal Boras as Keuchel's agent. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Nov 6, 2019 20:34:09 GMT -6
We'll see what type of magician Strom really is when he's trying to coax Urquidy, McCullers, Whitley, Lasagna through the season next year. (And don't forget the bullpen of Pressly, Osuna, Peacock, Cheeseburger, and Gatorade.) had you rather have an idiot like Doug Brocail??? I don' t know any pitching coaches I had rather have than Strom. I like Strom. I just think people worship him too much. Like I said before, his magic should extend to closers in the postseason but it doesn’t. |
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Post by olpapa on Nov 7, 2019 20:07:04 GMT -6
I wonder how many, if any, of the guys who got the QO will go unsigned until after the Rule 4 draft. I could see that happening to Will Smith if he declines the QO. Maybe Abreu too.
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Post by Hunter McCormick on Nov 8, 2019 1:00:40 GMT -6
I wonder how many, if any, of the guys who got the QO will go unsigned until after the Rule 4 draft. I could see that happening to Will Smith if he declines the QO. Maybe Abreu too. The two you mentioned are among the four I think fairly likely to accept the QO. But here's something else to remember. Even if a player rejects a QO, that doesn't mean he's looking for a higher salary next year. He might be looking to lock up four years or so at an annual rate that's significantly lower than the $17.8 million. Why not grab the extra money on a one-year deal? A career ending injury 2020 would mean that's the last contract the player will ever get. It might be worth while to lock up several years while he can. |
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Post by olpapa on Nov 8, 2019 8:02:47 GMT -6
I wonder how many, if any, of the guys who got the QO will go unsigned until after the Rule 4 draft. I could see that happening to Will Smith if he declines the QO. Maybe Abreu too. The two you mentioned are among the four I think fairly likely to accept the QO. But here's something else to remember. Even if a player rejects a QO, that doesn't mean he's looking for a higher salary next year. He might be looking to lock up four years or so at an annual rate that's significantly lower than the $17.8 million. Why not grab the extra money on a one-year deal? A career ending injury 2020 would mean that's the last contract the player will ever get. It might be worth while to lock up several years while he can. I too would not be at all surprised to see Smith and Abreu accept the QO. As players watch more and more guys reject the QO and then go unsigned until June, I think we will see an increasing number of players accepting the QO in the future. |
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Post by Saint on Nov 8, 2019 9:05:57 GMT -6
I think the White Sox and Abreu both plan on coming back on a multi-year (but lower AAV) deal.
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Post by unionstation82 on Nov 8, 2019 9:23:15 GMT -6
I think the White Sox and Abreu both plan on coming back on a multi-year (but lower AAV) deal. This dude is Luhnow’s idol. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him go after Abreu if he rejects the QO. Then, the transition away from Yuli will be smooth. |
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Post by Saint on Nov 8, 2019 9:50:30 GMT -6
I think the White Sox and Abreu both plan on coming back on a multi-year (but lower AAV) deal. This dude is Luhnow’s idol. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him go after Abreu if he rejects the QO. Then, the transition away from Yuli will be smooth. I very much doubt they would invest more payroll in another aging 1B right now. And Abreu and the White Sox seem to have a very good mutual like for each other. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Nov 8, 2019 10:28:46 GMT -6
I think the White Sox and Abreu both plan on coming back on a multi-year (but lower AAV) deal. This dude is Luhnow’s idol. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him go after Abreu if he rejects the QO. Then, the transition away from Yuli will be smooth. Moving away from Yuli now makes no sense. |
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Post by ɮօʀȶǟʐ on Nov 8, 2019 10:49:09 GMT -6
I think the White Sox and Abreu both plan on coming back on a multi-year (but lower AAV) deal. This dude is Luhnow’s idol. I wouldn’t be surprised to see him go after Abreu if he rejects the QO. Then, the transition away from Yuli will be smooth. What makes you think 1. they want to transition away from Yuli, and 2. They'd do it with a guy who is more expensive and nearly as old? Yuli was the best player on this team for a large section of the season this year, but some of you guys are still constantly scanning the horizon for his replacement. It's inexplicable. |
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Post by Hunter McCormick on Nov 8, 2019 11:12:15 GMT -6
The two you mentioned are among the four I think fairly likely to accept the QO. But here's something else to remember. Even if a player rejects a QO, that doesn't mean he's looking for a higher salary next year. He might be looking to lock up four years or so at an annual rate that's significantly lower than the $17.8 million. Why not grab the extra money on a one-year deal? A career ending injury 2020 would mean that's the last contract the player will ever get. It might be worth while to lock up several years while he can. I too would not be at all surprised to see Smith and Abreu accept the QO. As players watch more and more guys reject the QO and then go unsigned until June, I think we will see an increasing number of players accepting the QO in the future. That happens when a player (and his agent) holds out for too much. For instance, Keuchel wasn't wrong for rejecting the QO. But his contract demands were ridiculous.
The number of players accepting the QO will depend on how many of them get the offer but aren't really worth that much on a one-year deal. I can imagine several situations where a team wants stability for one more year and are willing to pay a few million in excess to retain a fairly good player until someone in their farm is ready to step into the role.
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