|
|
Post by astrosdoug on May 12, 2018 7:55:02 GMT -6
Share far and wide if you have a Facebook or Twitter account   |
|
|
|
Post by olpapa on May 12, 2018 8:18:40 GMT -6
Verlander is going to be 4-2 despite an ERA of only 1.21. wow. When I see the outstanding pitching by JV being wasted game after game due to lack of support from the offense I am reminded of Nolan Ryan’s 1987 season with Houston. He should have won the Cy Young that year. Probably would have had it not been for his W-L record. He made 34 starts. Pitched 211.2 innings. Led the league in ERA (2.76), Ks (270), Ks/9 (11.5), Ks/BB(3.10), H/9 (6.5) and for you sabr guys, ERA+ (142) and FIP (2.47)....., but he finished the season with a 8-16 W-L record. He finished 5th in the CYA voting. In 8 of his 16 losses the Astros scored 1 or 0 runs. In another 4 of his losses the team scored 2 runs. In 2 of his losses the team scored 3 runs. The voters gave the CYA to Steve Bedrosian who pitched 89 innings and had an ERA of 2.83 and led the league in just one category...”saves.” So JV has a HOFer close by who can empathize with what he is going through this season. |
|
|
|
Post by astrosdoug on May 12, 2018 8:25:14 GMT -6
Verlander is going to be 4-2 despite an ERA of only 1.21. wow. When I see the outstanding pitching by JV being wasted game after game due to lack of support from the offense I am reminded of Nolan Ryan’s 1987 season with Houston. He should have won the Cy Young that year. Probably would have had it not been for his W-L record. He made 34 starts. Pitched 211.2 innings. Led the league in ERA (2.76), Ks (270), Ks/9 (11.5), Ks/BB(3.10), H/9 (6.5) and for you sabr guys, ERA+ (142) and FIP (2.47)....., but he finished the season with a 8-16 W-L record. He finished 5th in the CYA voting. In 8 of his 16 losses the Astros scored 1 or 0 runs. In another 4 of his losses the team scored 2 runs. In 2 of his losses the team scored 3 runs. The voters gave the CYA to Steve Bedrosian who pitched 89 innings and had an ERA of 2.83 and led the league in just one category...”saves.” So JV has a HOFer close by who can empathize with what he is going through this season. I remember that 1987 season and reading about Nolan's struggles in the old Houston Post newspaper. They seemed to have much better pictures of the games than the Chronicle. I wonder if Crane should start writing contracts in which players get a modest base salary in addition to a certain amount of money per hit, with extra money for extra-base hits. Would that change things? |
|
|
|
Post by olpapa on May 12, 2018 8:39:41 GMT -6
When I see the outstanding pitching by JV being wasted game after game due to lack of support from the offense I am reminded of Nolan Ryan’s 1987 season with Houston. He should have won the Cy Young that year. Probably would have had it not been for his W-L record. He made 34 starts. Pitched 211.2 innings. Led the league in ERA (2.76), Ks (270), Ks/9 (11.5), Ks/BB(3.10), H/9 (6.5) and for you sabr guys, ERA+ (142) and FIP (2.47)....., but he finished the season with a 8-16 W-L record. He finished 5th in the CYA voting. In 8 of his 16 losses the Astros scored 1 or 0 runs. In another 4 of his losses the team scored 2 runs. In 2 of his losses the team scored 3 runs. The voters gave the CYA to Steve Bedrosian who pitched 89 innings and had an ERA of 2.83 and led the league in just one category...”saves.” So JV has a HOFer close by who can empathize with what he is going through this season. I remember that 1987 season and reading about Nolan's struggles in the old Houston Post newspaper. They seemed to have much better pictures of the games than the Chronicle. I wonder if Crane should start writing contracts in which players get a modest base salary in addition to a certain amount of money per hit, with extra money for extra-base hits. Would that change things? The Post sports section was much better than the Chronicle’s sports section. Hated to see the Post shut down. What? Pay players based on how they do their job each year? That’ll never happen. |
|
|
|
Post by bearbryant on May 12, 2018 9:50:31 GMT -6
Verlander is going to be 4-2 despite an ERA of only 1.21. wow. When I see the outstanding pitching by JV being wasted game after game due to lack of support from the offense I am reminded of Nolan Ryan’s 1987 season with Houston. He should have won the Cy Young that year. Probably would have had it not been for his W-L record. |
|
|
|
Post by unionstation82 on May 12, 2018 9:54:15 GMT -6
When I see the outstanding pitching by JV being wasted game after game due to lack of support from the offense I am reminded of Nolan Ryan’s 1987 season with Houston. He should have won the Cy Young that year. Probably would have had it not been for his W-L record. If only Drayton spent more on offense post-2004. I guess Carlos Lee counts. |
|
|
|
Post by astrosdoug on May 12, 2018 10:32:40 GMT -6
for what it's worth, Gattis's hit last night only had a 33% probability of going for a hit based on launch angle and exit velocity. The fact he reached base had more to do with how the defense was playing him.
Reddick had a liner and Marwin had a groundout with hit probabilities of over 50%; they were just unlucky.
Still, even if both those batted balls had gone for hits, the Astros still would only have had 3 hits all game. At most, that might have sent the game into extras.
|
|
|
|
Post by Saint on May 12, 2018 11:03:35 GMT -6
Verlander is going to be 4-2 despite an ERA of only 1.21. wow. When I see the outstanding pitching by JV being wasted game after game due to lack of support from the offense I am reminded of Nolan Ryan’s 1987 season with Houston. He should have won the Cy Young that year. Probably would have had it not been for his W-L record. He made 34 starts. Pitched 211.2 innings. Led the league in ERA (2.76), Ks (270), Ks/9 (11.5), Ks/BB(3.10), H/9 (6.5) and for you sabr guys, ERA+ (142) and FIP (2.47)....., but he finished the season with a 8-16 W-L record. He finished 5th in the CYA voting. In 8 of his 16 losses the Astros scored 1 or 0 runs. In another 4 of his losses the team scored 2 runs. In 2 of his losses the team scored 3 runs. The voters gave the CYA to Steve Bedrosian who pitched 89 innings and had an ERA of 2.83 and led the league in just one category...”saves.” So JV has a HOFer close by who can empathize with what he is going through this season. Yup. Ryan is my 2nd favorite player after Bagwell. I used to have all sorts of his stats memorized. I'm too young to remember the 87 season, but it was always an interesting statistical anomaly on his cards. |
|
marshall
Veteran
21st Century Luddite
Ephesians 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood...
Posts: 4,358 
Likes: 446
|
Post by marshall on May 12, 2018 11:18:36 GMT -6
Nolan was a local High School Phenom when I was growing up. He became a pro with the Mets just as I got to High School. When thy first started making guns to record velocities, there were rumors he was hitting 105 which led to arguments over the accuracy of the guns.
In any event, he started getting about one No Hitter a year for the Angels while I was in High School. When he was aquired bu the Astros for a Million Dollars a year, I thought it was a bargain.
As much as I love Bagwell and Biggio, Nolan is tops in my book.
And now he even makes beef and sausage. He's a real renaissance man.
|
|
|
|
Post by blcoach8 on May 12, 2018 11:48:22 GMT -6
Maybe the starting pitchers should call a player's only meeting and chew on some asses.
|
|
|
|
Post by thomasj13 on May 13, 2018 8:01:38 GMT -6
Maybe the starting pitchers should call a player's only meeting and chew on some asses. There you go again with the man-on-man innuendos |
|
|
|
Post by olpapa on May 14, 2018 12:47:51 GMT -6
When I see the outstanding pitching by JV being wasted game after game due to lack of support from the offense I am reminded of Nolan Ryan’s 1987 season with Houston. He should have won the Cy Young that year. Probably would have had it not been for his W-L record. He made 34 starts. Pitched 211.2 innings. Led the league in ERA (2.76), Ks (270), Ks/9 (11.5), Ks/BB(3.10), H/9 (6.5) and for you sabr guys, ERA+ (142) and FIP (2.47)....., but he finished the season with a 8-16 W-L record. He finished 5th in the CYA voting. In 8 of his 16 losses the Astros scored 1 or 0 runs. In another 4 of his losses the team scored 2 runs. In 2 of his losses the team scored 3 runs. The voters gave the CYA to Steve Bedrosian who pitched 89 innings and had an ERA of 2.83 and led the league in just one category...”saves.” So JV has a HOFer close by who can empathize with what he is going through this season. Yup. Ryan is my 2nd favorite player after Bagwell. I used to have all sorts of his stats memorized. I'm too young to remember the 87 season, but it was always an interesting statistical anomaly on his cards. Our discussion about Astros starting pitchers put me to thinking and an Astros starter who came to mind was Dave Giusti. His 1968 season may be the best example of all-time of an Astros starter who pitched great baseball and got no support from his teammates. His W-L record in 1968 was 11-14. Here are the innings pitched, earned runs allowed and final score numbers from his 14 losses: 7 IP, 2 ER, lost 2-1 8 IP, 1 ER, lost 2-0 8 IP, 2 ER, lost 2-1 8 IP, 0 ER, lost 1-0 7 IP, 3 ER, lost 3-1 5.1 IP, 3 ER, lost 5-0 7.2 IP, 3 ER, lost 3-2 8 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-3 6.1 IP, 5 ER, lost 5-0 7.1 IP, 6 ER, lost 7-1 6 IP, 2 ER, lost 4-1 9 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-1 7.1 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-1 1.2 IP, 3 ER, lost 4-1 If I am counting right the team scored a total of 13 runs in his 14 losses. |
|
|
|
Post by blcoach8 on May 14, 2018 13:49:10 GMT -6
I remember Giusti...got zero run support and later became an excellent reliever with the Pirates
|
|
|
|
Post by Saint on May 14, 2018 14:02:16 GMT -6
Yup. Ryan is my 2nd favorite player after Bagwell. I used to have all sorts of his stats memorized. I'm too young to remember the 87 season, but it was always an interesting statistical anomaly on his cards. Our discussion about Astros starting pitchers put me to thinking and an Astros starter who came to mind was Dave Giusti. His 1968 season may be the best example of all-time of an Astros starter who pitched great baseball and got no support from his teammates. His W-L record in 1968 was 11-14. Here are the innings pitched, earned runs allowed and final score numbers from his 14 losses: 7 IP, 2 ER, lost 2-1 8 IP, 1 ER, lost 2-0 8 IP, 2 ER, lost 2-1 8 IP, 0 ER, lost 1-0 7 IP, 3 ER, lost 3-1 5.1 IP, 3 ER, lost 5-0 7.2 IP, 3 ER, lost 3-2 8 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-3 6.1 IP, 5 ER, lost 5-0 7.1 IP, 6 ER, lost 7-1 6 IP, 2 ER, lost 4-1 9 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-1 7.1 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-1 1.2 IP, 3 ER, lost 4-1 If I am counting right the team scored a total of 13 runs in his 14 losses. 8 IP, 0 ER, lost 1-0 LMAO. Loses with an unearned run. Wasn't there a guy that threw a no-hitter and lost back in the 90's? I think his team had like three errors or something. |
|
|
|
Post by olpapa on May 14, 2018 15:10:52 GMT -6
Our discussion about Astros starting pitchers put me to thinking and an Astros starter who came to mind was Dave Giusti. His 1968 season may be the best example of all-time of an Astros starter who pitched great baseball and got no support from his teammates. His W-L record in 1968 was 11-14. Here are the innings pitched, earned runs allowed and final score numbers from his 14 losses: 7 IP, 2 ER, lost 2-1 8 IP, 1 ER, lost 2-0 8 IP, 2 ER, lost 2-1 8 IP, 0 ER, lost 1-0 7 IP, 3 ER, lost 3-1 5.1 IP, 3 ER, lost 5-0 7.2 IP, 3 ER, lost 3-2 8 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-3 6.1 IP, 5 ER, lost 5-0 7.1 IP, 6 ER, lost 7-1 6 IP, 2 ER, lost 4-1 9 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-1 7.1 IP, 4 ER, lost 4-1 1.2 IP, 3 ER, lost 4-1 If I am counting right the team scored a total of 13 runs in his 14 losses. 8 IP, 0 ER, lost 1-0 LMAO. Loses with an unearned run. Wasn't there a guy that threw a no-hitter and lost back in the 90's? I think his team had like three errors or something. Ken Johnson threw a no-hitter for Houston back in the ‘60s and lost. I can’t remember the one in the ‘90s. Did you notice that in 12 of Giusti’s 14 losses the Astros scored 1 or 0 runs? |
|
|
|
Post by Saint on May 14, 2018 15:23:36 GMT -6
8 IP, 0 ER, lost 1-0 LMAO. Loses with an unearned run. Wasn't there a guy that threw a no-hitter and lost back in the 90's? I think his team had like three errors or something. Ken Johnson threw a no-hitter for Houston back in the ‘60s and lost. I can’t remember the one in the ‘90s. Did you notice that in 12 of Giusti’s 14 losses the Astros scored 1 or 0 runs? I did. That's a shame. I know W/L records aren't supposed to mean a lot to pitchers but that would have to piss you off. And I remembered what I was thinking about. Andy Hawkins in 1990. 8 IP CG no-hitter with 4 unearned runs and got the loss. 5 BBs and 0 Hits. |
|
|
|
Post by olpapa on May 14, 2018 15:30:50 GMT -6
Ken Johnson threw a no-hitter for Houston back in the ‘60s and lost. I can’t remember the one in the ‘90s. Did you notice that in 12 of Giusti’s 14 losses the Astros scored 1 or 0 runs? I did. That's a shame. I know W/L records aren't supposed to mean a lot to pitchers but that would have to piss you off. And I remembered what I was thinking about. Andy Hawkins in 1990. 8 IP CG no-hitter with 4 unearned runs and got the loss. 5 BBs and 0 Hits. Here is an article on Ken Johnson’s no-hitter. He was the first pitcher in major league history to lose a 9 inning no-hitter: calltothepen.com/2017/04/23/astros-history-ken-johnson-loses-nine-inning-no-hitter/ |
|
|
|
Post by Saint on May 14, 2018 15:34:27 GMT -6
I did. That's a shame. I know W/L records aren't supposed to mean a lot to pitchers but that would have to piss you off. And I remembered what I was thinking about. Andy Hawkins in 1990. 8 IP CG no-hitter with 4 unearned runs and got the loss. 5 BBs and 0 Hits. Here is an article on Ken Johnson’s no-hitter. He was the first pitcher in major league history to lose a 9 inning no-hitter: calltothepen.com/2017/04/23/astros-history-ken-johnson-loses-nine-inning-no-hitter/Yeah I was just reading that. I had never heard about this game for some reason. |
|
|
|
Post by olpapa on May 14, 2018 15:42:47 GMT -6
I was 12 years old when Johnson lost that no-hitter. I listened to every Houston game on a little AM radio that was powered by a 9 volt battery. It was tough being a Colt 45/Astros fan back in those days.
|
|
|
|
Post by m240 on May 14, 2018 20:03:48 GMT -6
I did. That's a shame. I know W/L records aren't supposed to mean a lot to pitchers but that would have to piss you off. And I remembered what I was thinking about. Andy Hawkins in 1990. 8 IP CG no-hitter with 4 unearned runs and got the loss. 5 BBs and 0 Hits. Here is an article on Ken Johnson’s no-hitter. He was the first pitcher in major league history to lose a 9 inning no-hitter: calltothepen.com/2017/04/23/astros-history-ken-johnson-loses-nine-inning-no-hitter/I stole my dad's keys and went out to listen to that game on the car radio as we did not have one inside the house. Made me so mad and confused me so much. I was like how do you lose a no hitter in 9 innings. Rose's hustle sealed that deal. |
|
|
|
Post by m240 on May 14, 2018 20:04:55 GMT -6
I left out I got into a lot of trouble for that little deal. I left the keys on all night and back then no one had jumper cables.
|
|
|
|
Post by unionstation82 on May 14, 2018 22:45:55 GMT -6
I was 12 years old when Johnson lost that no-hitter. I listened to every Houston game on a little AM radio that was powered by a 9 volt battery. It was tough being a Colt 45/Astros fan back in those days. I read that Johnson had to console an apologetic Nellie Fox after the game. Really sad stuff there. |
|
|
|
Post by blcoach8 on May 14, 2018 22:55:37 GMT -6
I was 12 years old when Johnson lost that no-hitter. I listened to every Houston game on a little AM radio that was powered by a 9 volt battery. It was tough being a Colt 45/Astros fan back in those days. i listened to that game, too Johnson, Turk Farrell, and Bob Bruce used to lose a lot of 1-0 and 2-1 games because we just flat couldn't score runs. I listened to Don Nottebart's no-hitter against the Phillies. The main thing I did that made me sick was the weekend I was in Houston for series with the Braves. I had to leave after the Saturday game.........Don Wilson pitched a no-hitter the next day and I didn't get to see it..... |
|
|
|
Post by thomasj13 on May 15, 2018 13:06:11 GMT -6
I left out I got into a lot of trouble for that little deal. I left the keys on all night and back then no one had jumper cables. Pick your Switch....Switch, everyone acted like that was so bad...bad is a vacuum cord.... |
|
|
|
Post by m240 on May 15, 2018 13:08:19 GMT -6
I left out I got into a lot of trouble for that little deal. I left the keys on all night and back then no one had jumper cables. Pick your Switch....Switch, everyone acted like that was so bad...bad is a vacuum cord.... All cords are bad when used like that. |
|
