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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 8:17:10 GMT -6
agreed. The game was over on the Seager home run and then Zuniga but the icing on the cake. Kalas and Blum kept talking about hard hit balls......that's great if some turn into hits. Then, in predictable fashion, Hinch spent the post-game press conference trying to sound like Keuchel wasn't so bad......when you give up six runs in 2 innings, that is terrible. He is now 3-8 and has no business staying in the rotation. But, since Hinch seems to refuse to admit how bad he is, he will keep taking his turn. I’m just sick and tired of people talking about Keuchel and bad luck. It’s time to face facts that 2014-2015 Keuchel is a thing of the past. He’ll show flashes of brilliance even in the last World Series Game 1. More often than not, hitters just peck away at him, especially when they’ve seen him a couple of times in the same game. He doesn’t have “blow you away” stuff. He relies on getting hitters to swing at garbage out of the zone in hopes of a GIDP, which fails because they’ve caught onto his game and will make an effort to beat shifts. Umpires have also made a conscious decision to not call his out of the zone strikes. It’s just annoying to see these grueling innings pile up for Keuchel. "I’m just sick and tired of people talking about Keuchel and bad luck." But it's accurate. If you watched the first inning you would have seen that the overwhelming majority of the time he wouldn't have given up any runs in that first inning. Not only was the HR weak, but he wouldn't have even come up to bat that inning. With the weak groundballs that were hit, the inning should have been over as soon as Nelson Cruz got his "hit". Keuchel is obviously not at his best, but denying that he has had bad luck is ignoring what has really been going on. Is he still an ace? No. But he's still an above average pitcher for a very reasonable cost. I'm not against giving him a day off or something, but Keuchel is not the reason we've been struggling. |
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 8:18:06 GMT -6
Keuchel is on pace to the lead the league in games lost.......put McHugh in the rotation. A lot of that is on the lack of run support he has gotten. |
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Post by paastrosfan on Jun 6, 2018 8:28:13 GMT -6
Keuchel is on pace to the lead the league in games lost.......put McHugh in the rotation. A lot of that is on the lack of run support he has gotten. A won-loss record of a pitcher is overrated. |
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 8:29:29 GMT -6
A lot of that is on the lack of run support he has gotten. A won-loss record of a pitcher is overrated. Yeah I'm surprised people still don't realize that. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Jun 6, 2018 8:32:08 GMT -6
Complaining about Keuchel doesn’t mean I think he’s the sole reason the team has been struggling. He’s one of many who isn’t living up to his end of the bargain this season. Keuchel also is an excellent fielder. He should’ve gotten Cruz out. Regardless of how far Seager hit the ball, that’s not what you want to see from the pitching of a groundball specialist. The home run was cheap, but as usual when Keuchel struggles, the steady traffic of baserunners preceded it.
Also, were the hits from Zunino and Segura legitimate for you? The bottom line is he’s an umpire-dependent pitcher who fluctuates depending on how wide his strikes are on a given day. If he misses location, he’s as good as Mike Fiers.
In Keuchel’s defense, though, I think the infield range is suspect. Correa is the only one who makes up for it because of the rocket arm. Bregman is great at going side to side but gets eaten up on slow rollers. Altuve seems to constantly be face first on the ground as a ball rolls to the outfield.
I honestly believe Keuchel’s ERA would be 20-30 points lower with a more polished defense, but when he gets hit hard, that’s solely on him.
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 8:34:32 GMT -6
Complaining about Keuchel doesn’t mean I think he’s the sole reason the team has been struggling. He’s one of many who isn’t living up to his end of the bargain this season. Keuchel also is an excellent fielder. He should’ve gotten Cruz out. Regardless of how far Seager hit the ball, that’s not what you want to see from the pitching of a groundball specialist. The home run was cheap, but as usual, the traffic jam of baserunners preceded it. Also, were the hits from Zunino and Segura legitimate for you? The bottom line is he’s an umpire-dependent pitcher who fluctuates depending on how wide his strikes are on a given day. If he misses location, he’s as good as Mike Fiers. In Keuchel’s defense, though, I think the infield range is suspect. Correa is the only one who makes up for it because of the rocket arm. Bregman is great at going side to side but gets eaten up on slow rollers. Altuve seems to constantly be face first on the ground as a ball rolls to the outfield. I honestly believe Keuchel’s ERA would be 20-30 points lower with a more polished defense, but when he gets hit hard, that’s solely on him. He was certainly fully responsible for the the two later HRs. It should have been 3 runs in 7 IP. Still not good enough for us to win since the offense couldn't put anything together. On most teams he's a #3-#4 starter that should win more games than he loses. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2018 8:45:33 GMT -6
Tonight's game is more important than we realize. If we give these upstarts another W on our turf, it will give them a shot of confidence, (not to mention a 3 game league) that we might not want to be dealing with come September.
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Post by unionstation82 on Jun 6, 2018 8:48:02 GMT -6
He was certainly fully responsible for the the two later HRs. It should have been 3 runs in 7 IP. Still not good enough for us to win since the offense couldn't put anything together. On most teams he's a #3-#4 starter that should win more games than he loses. That’s assuming Seager wouldn’t have come through in a different way in the first inning. The bottom line is a so-called big part of this rotation shouldn’t have crappy first innings like yesterday, which was similar to his game against Kluber at home. He is neck-in-neck with McCullers in terms of inconsistency, but at least McCullers does a better job at throwing hard and teasing the strike zone. I think we and many others agree about the offense, which is why the majority of us wrote off the game after it was 4-0. This offense doesn’t have the ability to overcome that deficit most of the time let alone against James Paxton. You may not think these losses are a big deal, but to me the mystique about being world champions is lost on these opponents when they witness the lack of fight in the Astros. With each game against tough teams, the Astros look more and more average. The one-run record is also absurdly bad. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Jun 6, 2018 11:09:20 GMT -6
The offense has been a lot less productive than last season and we didn't expect that. The bullpen is too weak to be trusted to hold leads in close games.
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Post by olpapa on Jun 6, 2018 11:29:05 GMT -6
A lot of that is on the lack of run support he has gotten. A won-loss record of a pitcher is overrated. You’re right about that. The W-L stat is as misleading as is the “save” stat. |
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 11:59:29 GMT -6
A won-loss record of a pitcher is overrated. You’re right about that. The W-L stat is as misleading as is the “save” stat. Overrated and misleading, yes. Worthless, no. And with "saves" it's not so much the name as it is the situation. |
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Post by paastrosfan on Jun 6, 2018 12:36:38 GMT -6
A won-loss record of a pitcher is overrated. You’re right about that. The W-L stat is as misleading as is the “save” stat. Maybe you can remember the pitchers name for the Stros, I can't off hand during the 2000's a lefty that had over 15 wins and he seemed to win games when the Stros had big offensive days. His record was questioned because of that, not his pitching ability, the next season he fizzled out. |
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 12:40:47 GMT -6
You’re right about that. The W-L stat is as misleading as is the “save” stat. Maybe you can remember the pitchers name for the Stros, I can't off hand during the 2000's a lefty that had over 15 wins and he seemed to win games when the Stros had big offensive days. His record was questioned because of that, not his pitching ability, the next season he fizzled out. Jeriome Robertson. His 2nd season he went 15-9 despite a 5.10 ERA. He only played 3 seasons but ended up with a 16-12 record despite a career 5.71 ERA (77 ERA+). He was actually a negative WAR pitcher but won more than he lost. |
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Post by paastrosfan on Jun 6, 2018 12:41:42 GMT -6
Maybe you can remember the pitchers name for the Stros, I can't off hand during the 2000's a lefty that had over 15 wins and he seemed to win games when the Stros had big offensive days. His record was questioned because of that, not his pitching ability, the next season he fizzled out. Jeriome Robertson. His 2nd season he went 15-9 despite a 5.10 ERA. He only played 3 seasons but ended up with a 16-12 record despite a career 5.71 ERA (77 ERA+). He was actually a negative WAR pitcher but won more than he lost. Good call that is the guy. |
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 12:42:49 GMT -6
I only remember because my dad and I used to joke about how we knew the Astros would hit well that day just because he was on the mound.
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Post by olpapa on Jun 6, 2018 13:56:33 GMT -6
Jeriome Robertson. His 2nd season he went 15-9 despite a 5.10 ERA. He only played 3 seasons but ended up with a 16-12 record despite a career 5.71 ERA (77 ERA+). He was actually a negative WAR pitcher but won more than he lost. Good call that is the guy. I remember the guys in the booth would talk about what a good job Robertson was doing and I would just shake my head.....much like I do nowadays when someone talks about what a good job a relief pitcher is doing who is 10/10 in “save” opportunities, but has a 5.21 ERA; a .291 BAA and can’t be trusted to protect a 5 run lead. |
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 14:19:13 GMT -6
Good call that is the guy. I remember the guys in the booth would talk about what a good job Robertson was doing and I would just shake my head.....much like I do nowadays when someone talks about what a good job a relief pitcher is doing who is 10/10 in “save” opportunities, but has a 5.21 ERA; a .291 BAA and can’t be trusted to protect a 5 run lead. I've just said that he's done a good job in those situations. Because he has. The numbers show it. He hasn't been good overall, obviously. I was trying to think of the best way to describe my thoughts earlier, and what I came to is that I think Giles is an adequate closer in what are now considered normal save opportunities. However, he is certainly not a shutdown reliever like Devenski normally is or who Andrew Miller was. But if we need a guy to close out the final inning of a close game, he typically does quite well in those situations. So if we were to trade for a reliever, it really needs to be somebody who is better in those different types of situations. Maybe Herrera or someone else, I don't know. I just don't think we need to trade for somebody to stick in the current defined "closer" role. Giles can do that. Call it a mental thing or whatever with Giles, but, for whatever reason, he performs well in that capacity. It's like having a "lefty specialist" that comes in to pitch to one batter. He's a "save situation" specialist. Course, I'll say all that and he'll blow a 2-run lead tonight. |
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marshall
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Ephesians 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood...
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Post by marshall on Jun 6, 2018 16:32:53 GMT -6
I remember the guys in the booth would talk about what a good job Robertson was doing and I would just shake my head.....much like I do nowadays when someone talks about what a good job a relief pitcher is doing who is 10/10 in “save” opportunities, but has a 5.21 ERA; a .291 BAA and can’t be trusted to protect a 5 run lead. I've just said that he's done a good job in those situations. Because he has. The numbers show it. He hasn't been good overall, obviously. I was trying to think of the best way to describe my thoughts earlier, and what I came to is that I think Giles is an adequate closer in what are now considered normal save opportunities. However, he is certainly not a shutdown reliever like Devenski normally is or who Andrew Miller was. But if we need a guy to close out the final inning of a close game, he typically does quite well in those situations. So if we were to trade for a reliever, it really needs to be somebody who is better in those different types of situations. Maybe Herrera or someone else, I don't know. I just don't think we need to trade for somebody to stick in the current defined "closer" role. Giles can do that. Call it a mental thing or whatever with Giles, but, for whatever reason, he performs well in that capacity. It's like having a "lefty specialist" that comes in to pitch to one batter. He's a "save situation" specialist. Course, I'll say all that and he'll blow a 2-run lead tonight. You're expecting us to have a two run lead? |
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 17:22:01 GMT -6
I have a good feeling.
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Post by unionstation82 on Jun 6, 2018 17:54:01 GMT -6
In your pants about Giles, you ghey! |
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Post by Saint on Jun 6, 2018 18:12:06 GMT -6
In your pants about Giles, you ghey! Whatever gets the win! #nohomo |
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marshall
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Ephesians 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood...
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Post by marshall on Jun 6, 2018 18:34:43 GMT -6
Well we made it through the first inning without being hopelessly behind.
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