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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 7:56:33 GMT -6
No, she said nothing happened. We released him with no evidence and then she claimed it didn't happen. She may have been scared to keep pursuing it. Possibly, but I've never liked how that was handled. The Astros FO assumed guilt and acted like liberals. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 29, 2019 9:44:43 GMT -6
She may have been scared to keep pursuing it. Possibly, but I've never liked how that was handled. The Astros FO assumed guilt and acted like liberals. Drayton wanted the public to think the organization was squeaky clean. |
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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 10:32:32 GMT -6
Possibly, but I've never liked how that was handled. The Astros FO assumed guilt and acted like liberals. Drayton wanted the public to think the organization was squeaky clean. And I get that, but sometimes you have to support your players while more information is gathered. If there was evidence, so be it, but we didn't give him a chance. We released him for nothing, and he ended up having a very good prime of his career with TB (he was almost an average of 4.0 WAR a season player for them. That's about the same level as George Springer has been for us.) |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 29, 2019 11:06:11 GMT -6
Drayton wanted the public to think the organization was squeaky clean. And I get that, but sometimes you have to support your players while more information is gathered. If there was evidence, so be it, but we didn't give him a chance. We released him for nothing, and he ended up having a very good prime of his career with TB (he was almost an average of 4.0 WAR a season player for them. That's about the same level as George Springer has been for us.) I hope you aren't seriously comparing George Springer to Julio Lugo!!!!   " src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/angry.png"> |
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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 11:14:33 GMT -6
And I get that, but sometimes you have to support your players while more information is gathered. If there was evidence, so be it, but we didn't give him a chance. We released him for nothing, and he ended up having a very good prime of his career with TB (he was almost an average of 4.0 WAR a season player for them. That's about the same level as George Springer has been for us.) I hope you aren't seriously comparing George Springer to Julio Lugo!!!! " src="//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/angry.png"> I'm just using Springer as a baseline to show how good (overall) Lugo was for TB for a few years. And we gave him away for nothing. Springer is obviously a far superior player than Lugo. But Lugo did have a pretty good prime for a few seasons when you factor in more than just hitting. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 29, 2019 12:09:00 GMT -6
Drayton wanted the public to think the organization was squeaky clean. And I get that, but sometimes you have to support your players while more information is gathered. If there was evidence, so be it, but we didn't give him a chance. We released him for nothing, and he ended up having a very good prime of his career with TB (he was almost an average of 4.0 WAR a season player for them. That's about the same level as George Springer has been for us.) You realize that is completely the opposite of your attitude regarding Roberto Osuna. |
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Post by thomasj13 on Aug 29, 2019 12:20:33 GMT -6
And I get that, but sometimes you have to support your players while more information is gathered. If there was evidence, so be it, but we didn't give him a chance. We released him for nothing, and he ended up having a very good prime of his career with TB (he was almost an average of 4.0 WAR a season player for them. That's about the same level as George Springer has been for us.) You realize that is completely the opposite of your attitude regarding Roberto Osuna. Shhhh..you must let redhead dig deeper hole. |
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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 12:27:43 GMT -6
And I get that, but sometimes you have to support your players while more information is gathered. If there was evidence, so be it, but we didn't give him a chance. We released him for nothing, and he ended up having a very good prime of his career with TB (he was almost an average of 4.0 WAR a season player for them. That's about the same level as George Springer has been for us.) You realize that is completely the opposite of your attitude regarding Roberto Osuna. Oh, you don't get it. I still don't like or want Osuna. But they dropped Lugo immediately with nothing but an accusation. Osuna did it. He admitted to needing to be better, which means he did do something. We just don't know exactly what. But, since we have him, I want him to be successful because that means our team is successful. |
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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 12:28:12 GMT -6
You realize that is completely the opposite of your attitude regarding Roberto Osuna. Shhhh..you must let redhead dig deeper hole. No, if Lugo was found to do something I'd want him gone too. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 29, 2019 12:49:48 GMT -6
You realize that is completely the opposite of your attitude regarding Roberto Osuna. Oh, you don't get it. I still don't like or want Osuna. But they dropped Lugo immediately with nothing but an accusation. Osuna did it. He admitted to needing to be better, which means he did do something. We just don't know exactly what. But, since we have him, I want him to be successful because that means our team is successful. Was the information gathered that resulted in a one year peace bond sufficient for you? |
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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 12:56:57 GMT -6
Oh, you don't get it. I still don't like or want Osuna. But they dropped Lugo immediately with nothing but an accusation. Osuna did it. He admitted to needing to be better, which means he did do something. We just don't know exactly what. But, since we have him, I want him to be successful because that means our team is successful. Was the information gathered that resulted in a one year peace bond sufficient for you? Based on whatever MLB had to suspend him for 75 games, and the peace bond was enough for me to not want him. Same thing would have held for Lugo. But he got released like the day of or the day after, I can't remember. I'm not saying Osuna shouldn't be given a second chance if somebody wants him. I just didn't want it to be us. But, it's not the Houston Saints so it doesn't matter if I wanted him or not. |
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Post by ɮօʀȶǟʐ on Aug 29, 2019 13:04:26 GMT -6
I don't think that the penalty for a crime should go beyond what is defined in the relevant statute. It should not carry over into a person's ability to work at a job and provide for their family. No statute says "30 days in jail, and fired from his job at McDonalds."
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 29, 2019 13:08:23 GMT -6
Was the information gathered that resulted in a one year peace bond sufficient for you? Based on whatever MLB had to suspend him for 75 games, and the peace bond was enough for me to not want him. Same thing would have held for Lugo. But he got released like the day of or the day after, I can't remember. I'm not saying Osuna shouldn't be given a second chance if somebody wants him. I just didn't want it to be us. But, it's not the Houston Saints so it doesn't matter if I wanted him or not. Value to the team determined it for both, nothing more nothing less. |
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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 13:12:47 GMT -6
Based on whatever MLB had to suspend him for 75 games, and the peace bond was enough for me to not want him. Same thing would have held for Lugo. But he got released like the day of or the day after, I can't remember. I'm not saying Osuna shouldn't be given a second chance if somebody wants him. I just didn't want it to be us. But, it's not the Houston Saints so it doesn't matter if I wanted him or not. Value to the team determined it for both, nothing more nothing less. Yeah, apparently. But the knee jerk reaction with Lugo cost us value. Either from him the following few years, or from what we could have traded him for. |
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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 13:17:26 GMT -6
I don't think that the penalty for a crime should go beyond what is defined in the relevant statute. It should not carry over into a person's ability to work at a job and provide for their family. No statute says "30 days in jail, and fired from his job at McDonalds." I mostly agree. However, I also feel that getting to be a professional millionaire athlete is a privilege that should maintain somewhat of a higher standard. |
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Post by ɮօʀȶǟʐ on Aug 29, 2019 13:25:20 GMT -6
I don't think that the penalty for a crime should go beyond what is defined in the relevant statute. It should not carry over into a person's ability to work at a job and provide for their family. No statute says "30 days in jail, and fired from his job at McDonalds." I mostly agree. However, I also feel that getting to be a professional millionaire athlete is a privilege that should maintain somewhat of a higher standard. I thought we all agreed that character of a ballplayer wasn't important. |
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Post by Saint on Aug 29, 2019 13:32:59 GMT -6
I mostly agree. However, I also feel that getting to be a professional millionaire athlete is a privilege that should maintain somewhat of a higher standard. I thought we all agreed that character of a ballplayer wasn't important. Not me. I don't think overly emotional or show-offy should be a deciding factor, but physical violence should be a concern. |
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marshall
Veteran
21st Century Luddite
Ephesians 6:12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood...
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Post by marshall on Aug 30, 2019 7:52:24 GMT -6
Oh, you don't get it. I still don't like or want Osuna. But they dropped Lugo immediately with nothing but an accusation. Osuna did it. He admitted to needing to be better, which means he did do something. We just don't know exactly what. But, since we have him, I want him to be successful because that means our team is successful. Was the information gathered that resulted in a one year peace bond sufficient for you? There is no evidence required to get a Peace bond. Just a request which may or may not have anything to do with child custody or divorce settlement issues instead of real violence. If there was a trial and conviction, it would mean something. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 30, 2019 7:56:25 GMT -6
Was the information gathered that resulted in a one year peace bond sufficient for you? There is no evidence required to get a Peace bond. Just a request which may or may not have anything to do with child custody or divorce settlement issues instead of real violence. If there was a trial and conviction, it would mean something. Well, there it is then. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 30, 2019 7:58:13 GMT -6
I thought we all agreed that character of a ballplayer wasn't important. Not me. I don't think overly emotional or show-offy should be a deciding factor, but physical violence should be a concern. I agree. I just find it interesting that you longed for them to obtain more proof for Lugo, yet you were beside yourself about Osuna from the start. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 30, 2019 9:43:29 GMT -6
Not me. I don't think overly emotional or show-offy should be a deciding factor, but physical violence should be a concern. I agree. I just find it interesting that you longed for them to obtain more proof for Lugo, yet you were beside yourself about Osuna from the start. He still thinks Osuna is a "wufe beater" when Osuna has never been married.  |
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Post by thomasj13 on Aug 30, 2019 10:03:52 GMT -6
I agree. I just find it interesting that you longed for them to obtain more proof for Lugo, yet you were beside yourself about Osuna from the start. He still thinks Osuna is a "wufe beater" when Osuna has never been married. Married or not, you should never hit a woman....if labeling him as a "wife beater" mars his name more, then so be it. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 30, 2019 11:02:16 GMT -6
He still thinks Osuna is a "wufe beater" when Osuna has never been married. Married or not, you should never hit a woman....if labeling him as a "wife beater" mars his name more, then so be it. As far as we know, no evidence was presented to prove that he hit her. Too many times, things of this nature are conjured up by a scorned female to try to get revenge. |
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Post by thomasj13 on Aug 30, 2019 13:30:01 GMT -6
Married or not, you should never hit a woman....if labeling him as a "wife beater" mars his name more, then so be it. As far as we know, no evidence was presented to prove that he hit her. Too many times, things of this nature are conjured up by a scorned female to try to get revenge. or the lady recants because it will cost her boyfriend, fiance or husband millions...or his job....and they reconcile and go back being as a couple......or she gets paid off on the side.... |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 30, 2019 14:34:25 GMT -6
As far as we know, no evidence was presented to prove that he hit her. Too many times, things of this nature are conjured up by a scorned female to try to get revenge. or the lady recants because it will cost her boyfriend, fiance or husband millions...or his job....and they reconcile and go back being as a couple......or she gets paid off on the side.... all of those are possibilities |
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Post by Saint on Aug 30, 2019 14:50:42 GMT -6
Not me. I don't think overly emotional or show-offy should be a deciding factor, but physical violence should be a concern. I agree. I just find it interesting that you longed for them to obtain more proof for Lugo, yet you were beside yourself about Osuna from the start. Longed? I just said we dropped him immediately without anything. That's not right. The difference with Osuna is that there WAS something. Was there something on Lugo? No. Was there something on Osuna? Yes. What's not clear? |
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Post by Saint on Aug 30, 2019 14:52:17 GMT -6
Married or not, you should never hit a woman....if labeling him as a "wife beater" mars his name more, then so be it. As far as we know, no evidence was presented to prove that he hit her. Too many times, things of this nature are conjured up by a scorned female to try to get revenge. There was enough that he was suspended for an extended amount of time, and there was some type of Canadian protective order applied to him. He also had to make public semi-apology. Why else would all of that happen? |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 30, 2019 15:19:11 GMT -6
I agree. I just find it interesting that you longed for them to obtain more proof for Lugo, yet you were beside yourself about Osuna from the start. Longed? I just said we dropped him immediately without anything. That's not right. The difference with Osuna is that there WAS something. Was there something on Lugo? No. Was there something on Osuna? Yes. What's not clear? I’m not on Osuna’s side or anything. I’m just saying you wished as a member of this team that Lugo didn’t get cut immediately whereas you complained the entire time about Osuna first becoming a member of this team. Can you not see a difference? |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 30, 2019 15:22:42 GMT -6
Like Todd, I was none too thrilled about the Osuna acquisition because I felt it was a slap in the face to players here who were very vocal about the Danry Vasquez disaster uncovered by the security camera. I guess where we disagree is Lugo. I don’t think it was that big of a deal to release the guy.
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Post by Saint on Aug 30, 2019 17:14:11 GMT -6
Longed? I just said we dropped him immediately without anything. That's not right. The difference with Osuna is that there WAS something. Was there something on Lugo? No. Was there something on Osuna? Yes. What's not clear? I’m not on Osuna’s side or anything. I’m just saying you wished as a member of this team that Lugo didn’t get cut immediately whereas you complained the entire time about Osuna first becoming a member of this team. Can you not see a difference? No, the difference is more proof and/or more to the story. One had it and one didn't. Why would I want them to be the same? |
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