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Post by Saint on Aug 2, 2018 9:58:57 GMT -6
As far as Tyler White goes, you can think of it like this: There were 598 major league hitters with at least 100 PAs over the 2-year span from August 2016 until today. White ranks #93 on that list by wRC+, right below Andrew Benintendi and right above Shin-soo Choo. That's pretty elite company.
to see all 3 of them being on the ML roster next seasonIs White poor defensively everywhere? Gurriel is good with balls in the dirt, I'll give him that. |
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Post by bearbryant on Aug 2, 2018 10:02:45 GMT -6
With White I think it's more about his defense. He and Gattis are pretty limited where you can put them on the diamond, and you add Yuli's deteriorating glove it's tough
to see all 3 of them being on the ML roster next season Is White poor defensively everywhere? Gurriel is good with balls in the dirt, I'll give him that. |
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Post by ɮօʀȶǟʐ on Aug 2, 2018 10:06:30 GMT -6
Moving along, should the Astros take a chance on Josh Donaldson if he clears waivers? Wasn't he just placed on 60 day DL? |
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Post by astrosdoug on Aug 2, 2018 10:07:43 GMT -6
The Astros are probably better off without Gattis next year. They are kind of stuck with Yuli unless they want to eat a big loss and I don't think Crane or Luhnow are up for that.
Even without playing defense, White has value as a DH in a league where the median wRC+ at that position is 104.
However, his defense at 1B isn't as bad as a lot of people expect it to be. This year, White has the third-best Relative Zone Rating (RZR) among major league first basement with over 100 innings at the position (behind Dan Vogelbach and Matt Adams). By UZR, White ranks right near the league average (#30 out of 57 qualified first basemen). The truth of the matter probably lies somewhere in between those two rankings.
White's stocky build tends to give fans the impression that he could never be a good defender, but his play on the field suggests people are tending to rush to judgment.
Unless the Astros trade for a first baseman, once the 2019 season rolls around, I tend to think that White would make a great go-to first baseman in games against left-handed starting pitching, while Yuli could take the starts against righties. The guy not playing 1B could DH or sit on the bench and be ready to pinch hit late in a game.
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Post by astrosdoug on Aug 2, 2018 10:11:52 GMT -6
It looks like it was a good time to part ways with Luke Gregerson over the winter:
from mlbtr
"Meanwhile, it’s possible that veteran reliever Luke Gregerson won’t return to the majors this year, MLB.com’s Jenifer Langosch recently tweeted. Gregerson was sidelined with a shoulder injury when he suffered a torn meniscus that required surgery. The 34-year-old, who inked a two-year, $11MM pact with St. Louis over the winter, has only thrown 12 2/3 frames for the club this season. He allowed ten earned runs in that span, but more worryingly showed some other declines. Gregerson was working at about 1.5 mph less with his average heater than in 2017 while sporting a 12.6% swinging-strike rate that’s well off of his recent levels."
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Post by bearbryant on Aug 2, 2018 10:13:20 GMT -6
The Astros are probably better off without Gattis next year. They are kind of stuck with Yuli unless they want to eat a big loss and I don't think Crane or Luhnow are up for that. Even without playing defense, White has value as a DH in a league where the median wRC+ at that position is 104. However, his defense at 1B isn't as bad as a lot of people expect it to be. This year, White has the third-best Relative Zone Rating (RZR) among major league first basement with over 100 innings at the position (behind Dan Vogelbach and Matt Adams). By UZR, White ranks right near the league average (#30 out of 57 qualified first basemen). The truth of the matter probably lies somewhere in between those two rankings. White's stocky build tends to give fans the impression that he could never be a good defender, but his play on the field suggests people are tending to rush to judgment. Unless the Astros trade for a first baseman, once the 2019 season rolls around, I tend to think that White would make a great go-to first baseman in games against left-handed starting pitching, while Yuli could take the starts against righties. The guy not playing 1B could DH or sit on the bench and be ready to pinch hit late in a game. |
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Post by thomasj13 on Aug 2, 2018 10:14:29 GMT -6
Moving along, should the Astros take a chance on Josh Donaldson if he clears waivers? Wasn't he just placed on 60 day DL? Yeah, but does that mean 60 days from now, or counting time already spent on the DL? |
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Post by Saint on Aug 2, 2018 10:21:38 GMT -6
With the money we're going to need for our big guns if we want to keep some of them, I can't imagine them spending much money to bring Gattis back when they're already paying Gurriel $19 million over the next two years. Which is frustrating since Gurriel is barely hitting at a league average level this year and is already 34 years old. I know we signed him when we needed a 1B and he helped us last year for sure, but if his power doesn't come back soon or he doesn't figure out how to take some pitches and walk, his value is extremely limited.
If White can consistently show what he has shown thus far, you probably have to go with him over Gattis next year, sadly.
I wish we had more information on why they didn't want to try and use him more as a catcher. Obviously he's not great, but with more consistent work he probably could have been an adequate backup and then DH when he wasn't catching. A guy that can catch 50-60 games a year, when not DHing and while potentially hitting 30+ HRs over a full season, would fill a great spot for most teams.
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Post by olpapa on Aug 2, 2018 10:26:54 GMT -6
Wasn't he just placed on 60 day DL? Yeah, but does that mean 60 days from now, or counting time already spent on the DL? When I read on Donaldson’s player page on Blue Jays.com that he has been placed on the 60-day DL it did not indicate that the move to the 60-day DL was retroactive to a prior date. Whether that is significant or not, I don’t know. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 2, 2018 10:34:53 GMT -6
Moving along, should the Astros take a chance on Josh Donaldson if he clears waivers? Wasn't he just placed on 60 day DL? I thought that he was before. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 2, 2018 10:36:25 GMT -6
Donaldson would be a risky rental which hopefully can pay off. He probably isn’t good enough anymore to supplant Bregman, but he’d be great at 1B or DH. Imagine his bat with our lineup at full strength.
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Post by thomasj13 on Aug 2, 2018 10:50:49 GMT -6
Donaldson would be a risky rental which hopefully can pay off. He probably isn’t good enough anymore to supplant Bregman, but he’d be great at 1B or DH. Imagine his bat with our lineup at full strength. He would be a good bat to have in the playoffs....during the rest of September, he could play a little 3b, 1b...but mainly I would want him to get most of his ABs at DH...just want his bat for the playoffs, so why risk it. |
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Post by Saint on Aug 2, 2018 10:55:26 GMT -6
Donaldson is the kind of guy you take a chance on for a rental.
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Post by astrosdoug on Aug 2, 2018 10:58:56 GMT -6
Donaldson has had 131 PAs at Minute Maid, hitting .333 (1.081 OPS) with 7 HRs.
Yes, I think we have a winner.
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Post by thomasj13 on Aug 2, 2018 11:06:50 GMT -6
I would be all for Donaldson and Cutch being on the team for the playoffs. Cutch at LF....Donaldson (DH, 1B)....Other bench players would be Gattis (too bad he can't catch), Marisnick (defense), Marwin (super utility - too bad White or Kemp don't have a good arm) and Catcher....
Pitchers (12)
Verlander
Cole
Morton
Keuchel
McCullers
Osuna
Rondon
Pressly
McHugh
Peacock
Devo
Sipp (shudders)
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Post by thomasj13 on Aug 2, 2018 11:09:42 GMT -6
Osuna
Rondon
Pressly
McHugh
Peacock
Devo
Sipp (shudders)
Despite what we all think of Osuna....as far as bullpen that is pretty good.
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Post by Saint on Aug 2, 2018 11:10:22 GMT -6
I would be all for Donaldson and Cutch being on the team for the playoffs. Cutch at LF....Donaldson (DH, 1B)....Other bench players would be Gattis (too bad he can't catch), Marisnick (defense), Marwin (super utility - too bad White or Kemp don't have a good arm) and Catcher.... Pitchers (12) Verlander Cole Morton Keuchel McCullers Osuna Rondon Pressly McHugh Peacock Devo Sipp (shudders) That's a WS roster right there. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 2, 2018 13:01:37 GMT -6
You just referred to Saint's top productive hitters as minor leaguers. LOL He will go bat shit crazy. Why? They were minor leaguers last year or this year.... I'm not the one who ignores facts here. you are the one who ignores facts that dispute your stats.....you say White is a more productive hitter than Gurriel and then either backtrack or outright lie and claim you never said it. |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 2, 2018 13:07:01 GMT -6
Let’s not get too excited; 29 other teams need to pass on him first, but if you limit it to just contenders then the Astros have a shot.
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 2, 2018 13:07:54 GMT -6
Donaldson would be a risky rental which hopefully can pay off. He probably isn’t good enough anymore to supplant Bregman, but he’d be great at 1B or DH. Imagine his bat with our lineup at full strength. He would be a good bat to have in the playoffs....during the rest of September, he could play a little 3b, 1b...but mainly I would want him to get most of his ABs at DH...just want his bat for the playoffs, so why risk it. Hmm Donaldson or Marwin in the lineup? Bye, Felicia! |
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Post by unionstation82 on Aug 2, 2018 13:08:45 GMT -6
Donaldson is the kind of guy you take a chance on for a rental. YES |
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Post by Saint on Aug 2, 2018 13:19:53 GMT -6
Why? They were minor leaguers last year or this year.... I'm not the one who ignores facts here. you are the one who ignores facts that dispute your stats.....you say White is a more productive hitter than Gurriel and then either backtrack or outright lie and claim you never said it. Whatever makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside, big guy. |
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Post by thomasj13 on Aug 2, 2018 13:49:40 GMT -6
Let’s not get too excited; 29 other teams need to pass on him first, but if you limit it to just contenders then the Astros have a shot. If they are pending FAs, I don't see a big push for non-contending teams to want them...they would need to give up something for them + absorb a good portion of their remaining salary (if not all) |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 2, 2018 14:21:16 GMT -6
Donaldson is the kind of guy you take a chance on for a rental. That would depend on what it costs us to rent him. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 2, 2018 14:22:44 GMT -6
He would be a good bat to have in the playoffs....during the rest of September, he could play a little 3b, 1b...but mainly I would want him to get most of his ABs at DH...just want his bat for the playoffs, so why risk it. Hmm Donaldson or Marwin in the lineup? Bye, Felicia! There is no choice here.......I take Donaldson all day long. I think Donaldson is just the type of hitter Luhnow could be looking to bring in for the stretch drive and the playoffs. |
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Post by blcoach8 on Aug 2, 2018 14:35:57 GMT -6
you are the one who ignores facts that dispute your stats.....you say White is a more productive hitter than Gurriel and then either backtrack or outright lie and claim you never said it. Whatever makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside, big guy. Sorry, you had to be so obvious with trying to retract what you posted. More than once, you said White was more productive than Gurriel and he is not. His OBP is better,but, his PRODUCTION is not,. I know that you live and die with stats like most nerds would do. Warm and fuzzy?? is that all you have, junior... I am proud that you think stats is the whole story of a player and that in itself shows how little you actually know about not just baseball, but, sports in general. If possible, I wish we could poll the players in the clubhouse to get their opinion of exactly which one is more productive...White or Gurriel. Gurriel wins by a landslide. You could also ask them if they had rather have Jake Marisnick on the team than any of the guys called up to replace him.......Jake wins that poll hands down due to his enthusiasm, personality, and the energy he brings. Yes, I know his OBP, WAR, batting average, etc. are all horrible, but, you have to look at the big picture....Jake is a great outfielder, with great speed and instincts, and is a good, aggressive baserunner which is often needed in the late innings. Hinch will start him at time and he will produce offensively at times as he did yesterday. But, unless he changes, his offensive production will be spotty at best. But, he has value and is popular with the other players. Bortaz is right about the subject of White vs. Gurriel being beaten to death. You will not change my mind and I will not change yours so there is no need to keep going back and forth. I am done with it. you can keep relying solely on stats and I will keep relying on production and results that I see and that I can verify as I have done . |
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Post by Saint on Aug 2, 2018 14:37:06 GMT -6
Whatever makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside, big guy. Sorry, you had to be so obvious with trying to retract what you posted. More than once, you said White was more productive than Gurriel and he is not. His OBP is better,but, his PRODUCTION is not,. I know that you live and die with stats like most nerds would do. Warm and fuzzy?? is that all you have, junior... I am proud that you think stats is the whole story of a player and that in itself shows how little you actually know about not just baseball, but, sports in general. If possible, I wish we could poll the players in the clubhouse to get their opinion of exactly which one is more productive...White or Gurriel. Gurriel wins by a landslide. You could also ask them if they had rather have Jake Marisnick on the team than any of the guys called up to replace him.......Jake wins that poll hands down due to his enthusiasm, personality, and the energy he brings. Yes, I know his OBP, WAR, batting average, etc. are all horrible, but, you have to look at the big picture....Jake is a great outfielder, with great speed and instincts, and is a good, aggressive baserunner which is often needed in the late innings. Hinch will start him at time and he will produce offensively at times as he did yesterday. But, unless he changes, his offensive production will be spotty at best. But, he has value and is popular with the other players. Bortaz is right about the subject of White vs. Gurriel being beaten to death. You will not change my mind and I will not change yours so there is no need to keep going back and forth. I am done with it. you can keep relying solely on stats and I will keep relying on production and results that I see and that I can verify as I have done . Okay, Coach. |
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Post by bearbryant on Aug 2, 2018 14:47:31 GMT -6
individual Astros wRC+ last 30 days
White ......... 157
Bregman .... 153
Kemp ......... 125
Stassi ......... 117
Gurriel ......... 97
Gonzalez ...... 90
Marisnick ...... 70
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Post by Saint on Aug 2, 2018 14:50:48 GMT -6
individual Astros wRC+ last 30 days
White ......... 157
Bregman .... 153
Kemp ......... 125
Stassi ......... 117
Gurriel ......... 97
Gonzalez ...... 90
Marisnick ...... 70
Already posted it. Didn't matter. |
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Post by bearbryant on Aug 2, 2018 14:53:12 GMT -6
my bad .. that was entire season thus far
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